Complex use case - live duo, and corp/wedding band

General discussion about Gig Performer
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I am a full-time professional musician, pianist and multi Keyboardist residing near Toronto, Ontario Canada.

I play in excess of 300 events annually with about 70% of my events being solo piano where I use a Nord stage 4 73 hammer action or clients grand or digital piano, combined with an ipad pro running backing tracks that I have created from the Great American Songbook repertoire, and custom created backing tracks using Stage Traxx 3. This use case is pretty simple, and no need to deal with complex splits, layers etc, Since almost 100% of the time, I am just selecting a really good acoustic piano sound, or on occasion, piano with strings or electric piano, and keeping the keyboard part very simple because I am playing Solo instrumental piano. For solo work I link pdf charts linked to songs in Stage Traxx 3, and either basic chord charts exported from iRealpro, or actual sheet music scanned and converted to pdf.

My second use case is leading a couple of different duos where in the past. I have been using my Nord stage 4 in combination with a Yamaha Tyros 5 76 key arranger workstation., but have been trying to reduce the labour of moving the tyros, and have convinced the two Singerā€™s that I play with that we will just record backing tracks and play them back on my ipad using Stage Trax 3. sometimes using the Tyros 5 to create backing tracks or creating my own backing tracks using Band-in-a-Box or in my home studio, where I have access to many VSTā€™s, and run Studio One professional as my main daw, but have years of experience with Logic(and some Ableton, ProTools) as well. For charts and lyrics for my duo work, I have been using OnSong, but have been shifting over to Stage Traxx 3 for everything, including charts. The midi functionality of Stage traxx 3 seems bit better than OnSong, as an example inserting midi program, and cc messages at certain times of a song playback. Ideally, woukd like to send imbedded midi program changes to GP to select song/song part rack spaces.

I would like to integrate my Macbook pro running Gig Performer in my duo rig, and then also create rack spaces that in addition to VST instruments, can also connect to these 3 Hardware devices, and communicate midi messages to select sounds (MSB,LSB,PC), to Nord Stage 4, Motif xs module, Roland Integra module, and possibly a second synth action kb like a 49key Arturia mk2, or older Roland A50 or A70 76 controller. Duo repertoire is approx 250 songs, from simple, to medium complex with some need for song parts, splits, layers but 75% basic, 25% complex.

My 3rd most demanding use case is freelance corp and wedding band work where I have to change songs, and song parts fast, and link charts in OnSong (preferred) or ForScore on my iPad. My live keyboard will be a Nord Stage 4, plus maybe my motif xs module, roland integra module, and create a full setlist, with song sections for around 300 songs. This repertoire is more like 75% complex, 25% basic. As an example, played a wedding last nite, and without stopping the band leader calledā€¦We Are Family, September EWF, Dancing queen, Beat it MJ, I will Survive, Uptown Funk, Play the Funky Music, Copacabana, Last Dance, I wanna dance with somebodyā€¦ā€¦yikesā€¦. I cant change sounds or charts fast enough to accomplish what I need, and its time to do the heavy lifting to make my duo, and wedding gig rig built with Gig Performer, but need some adice from advanced experts. I have years of experience using mainstage, but like the efficiency of GP, and computer performance with large song repertoires.

My softsyth collection is extensive but main GO TO. for live use will be

Omnisphere
Komplete 14
Arturia V Collection 7
Possibly Keyscape, Applied acoustics Lounge Lizzard

Looking forward to getting started with GP, and learning from all of you, and the developers of GP.

I have watched almost all of the backstage videos, and have a pretty good working understanding of the platform and have about another week left of my 14 day trial

2 Likes
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Youā€™ve packed a lot of different questions in there, all of which can be addressed in multiple ways.

I think everything youā€™re talking about doing, somebody here is doing with GP.

It sounds to me like your big questions for the GP community are ā€œhow can I best use GP when Iā€¦ā€

  • play backing tracks using Stage Traxx 3 (presumably linked some way to GP)
  • display charts/lyrics using Stage Traxx 3 or comparable (presumably linked to GP)
  • find and select songs in a large repertoire quickly, on the fly

The first two seem pretty easy to handle. Itā€™s just going to be a matter of deciding what you want to control what (e.g., what do you touch to choose and start your song). Your options will depend on your hardware routing and the midi capabilities/flexibility of whatever you use to control it. e.g., do you want to select a song in GP on your Macbook and have that tell Traxx what song to play, or vice versa?

The third one is more of a human interface challenge. How do you best search and select quickly?

I donā€™t have any real experience thatā€™s going to help with those. I just thought reframing the questions in more specific chunks might prompt some community answers for each one individually.

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You raise some valid points.

For my solo piano gigs, I donā€™t plan on using my laptop and GP.

For my duo work , I need to select songs, play the linked backing track, and view a chart, lyrics if needed

Maybe I can use the MacBook for everything with GP as the central orchestrator, including playing audio backing tracks, and displaying charts, and linking song parts to change Rackspace if needed.

The Corp, wedding gigs wonā€™t need playing backing tracks and will be more about fast choice of songs, with a chart, with lots of patch (Rackspace) changes linked to song parts, leveraging setlist mode. Might want to have my charts on my iPad in OnSong, and use GP as the place I select songs, which then selects the chart in OnSong

Does this make sense?

Net net

Use case 1 solo piano - no GP
Use case 2 Duos - GP for everything, incl backing tracks, charts
Use case 3 GP for songs, song parts, linked to charts in OnSong on an iPad (no backing tracks required)

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I canā€™t speak to the set ups with backup tracks.

With the Wedding band, the tricky thing is being able to switch songs that are not in pre-arranged order rapidly.

So, the best I can do is suggest some things you need to think about.

Can you select a song quickly on one device and have that make all the other changes on other devices (your setup in GP, your chart in FourScore, your settings on your Nord (if you are using that as as sound source)).

2nd. If you are able to do that, how can you quickly manage that initial change. If the laptop is right by you, GPā€™s ā€œfindā€ tool (in Setlist mode) works pretty quickly in finding the song in GP. Would that work? Is there a faster way? (There are some posts where people have set up widgets that allow them to select songs on the fly. Maybe look for those posts?)

[My set up would not work so great for you use case. But, that is in part because I use some inexpensive legacy equipment and I wanted to avoid further complexity in my set up].

Hope that helps, at least a little bitā€¦

[I responded before I saw your post, above].

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My quick thoughtsā€¦

  • Use OnSong on iPad as the ā€˜masterā€™ for song selection. Build your setlists there and develop your ad-hoc song search/select skills in one place.
  • In GigPerformer, use setlist mode and have OnSong send program changes to call up the matching Song.
  • I wouldnā€™t bother duplicating your setlists in GP. Use Setlist mode but have all your songs loaded in one gig so that theyā€™re all available. The order is not important, whatā€™s important is that all your songs are available for OnSongā€™s program change messages.

I use SongBook for similar use cases and find that using SongBook as my master I have one place to manage my sets and song selections. Muscle memory when performing is important ;). Iā€™m covered when:

  • I just need charts and nothing else - easy navigation of my entire chart library.
  • I have a gig with sets and as I flip through my charts, GigPerformer brings up the matching song for me and handles all the program changes for external gear as well.
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Good advice. I will use OnSong as my master song database, since almost all my songs there already.

I will create a single setlist (entire repertoire) with song parts if needed, in GP, and if required, play my backing tracks from GP and use markers in the Audio streamer to trigger rack space changes.

Are you connecting your Songbook app on a tablet/iPad to your laptop running GP via Bluetooth, or wired? I would prefer Bluetooth, to reduce number of wires and adapter set.

Iā€™m also going to test a CME widi master to connect my Nord stage 4 to my Macbook , and if all goes well, then buy 3 more and connect my motif xs rack, and Roland Integra, and Arturia 49mk2 so all my midi divides will be wireless and no cables. Want to make sure itā€™s stable before I try live.

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If you are using OnSong, you may want to check out our blog article here.

There are other tutorials (e.g. for MobileSheets and many others) indexed here.

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Iā€™m using a spare Surface tablet (portrait mode, detached keyboard) bluetooth connected to my Arturia Keylab 88 via CME widi master. Iā€™ve done it with an iPad as well, but prefer the bigger screen on the Surface. Works well!

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Good idea. Maybe Iā€™ll explore getting another tablet. I have a single cne widi on order to try out and should have it this Friday. Will start by getting the Nord Stage 4 connected via Bluetooth to my MacBook , then if all goes well, add my Arturia keylab mk2 49, motif xs, Roland Integra. I want to make sure latency is a non issue with the cne wifi, before I totally ditch standard usb cables to my MacBook.

Are you running OnSong on your surface tablet to select songs (song part) in GP?

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Iā€™m using SongBook on my Surfaceā€¦ but doing the same thing. Sending program change to Song parts in GigPerformer.

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I have made some good progress with my testing evaluation of gig performer and have successfully been able to link my iPad running onsong to send PC messages to select songs in GP Setlist mode and have also been able to link specific rackspaces with song parts, and updating my external hardware modules via program changes (MSB,LSB,PC) which are my Roland Integra and Yamaha motif and everything is working very well, including testing the CME widi Bluetooth adapter that is connected to my Roland Integra. next step is to replace my other usb cables with some more CME widi devices and have my Motif xs, Nord stage 4, Arturia mk2 49 all connected to my Macbook via bluetooth.

Some of my songs will use backing tracks (stereo wav or mp3 format, and no need for seperate stems at the moment).

I prefer to make use of GP setlist mode, and Songpart capability to select rackspaces that might be a single Integra, Motif, Nord Stage 4 patch, or a combination of these, and possibly some vsts like Omnispere, NI komplete 14, Arturia V collection etc.

so before I get too far down the path of building my GP rig, I realize some people use a rackspace(incl variations) per Song, but do not use Setlist mode.

how do I integrate the capability to play backing tracks using the Audio Streaming plugin while in setlist mode? how does the Song file (or song part) link to the Audio streaming stereo file, so I can trigger ā€˜startā€™ from a mapped button on my Arturia mk2 49?

it seems like the audio streaming plugin is linked to a rackspace, or is there another way to make playing backing tracks while in setlist mode work.

the marker action capability is of value, and realize I can select a rackspace by marker, but can I select a songpart, for the song in setlist mode?

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I keep all my setlists organised in ForScore on my iPad, and on each chart in ForScore I have a ForScore button configured to send a particular program change message to GP to select the song. I have a midi interface dangling from the iPad, connected to both the MIDI in and out jacks on the audio interface on my Windows laptop. I have a widget in GP configured to send the appropriate message to ForScore to get it to click the button, and a control on my MIDI keyboard connected to that widget. In GP I stay in setlist mode, but I donā€™t use any setlists at all (except for the default ā€œAll Songsā€ setlist).

I also have two more GP widgets configured to send MIDI messages to ForScore to go to the next and previous charts in the setlist, and buttons on my controller to activate those widgets.

So, during performance, I call up the appropriate chart in ForScore (either using the ā€œnextā€ button on my midi controller, or by searching directly on on the iPad), then I press the button on my MIDI keyboard or the iPad screen (whichever is more convenient at the moment) which causes GP to send the button-press message to ForScore to get it to send the PC message to GP to get it to call up the corresponding song in the ā€œAll Songsā€ setlist.

My MIDI keyboards are connected to the laptop via USB, but the iPad is connected to the laptop via 5-pin DIN (as mentioned above) because getting the iPad and Windows to talk MIDI to one another via USB or wifi or Bluetooth seemed like an insurmountable headache. The 5-pin DIN solution has been very reliable; it only fails when ForScore gets itself into a state where it wonā€™t listen to MIDI input (due to a ForScore bug, I suppose, which wouldnā€™t be solved by using USB or wireless), and even then a quick force-quit and restart of ForScore solves the problem.

The above might sound a bit complicated but in practice itā€™s smooth as butter. :slight_smile:

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I will use setlist same way as you, and just a long ā€˜masterā€™ library of all songs, but some need to be linked to a backing track for some solo, and duo gigs I do. are you using any backing tracks, and if so, how are you linking them to setlist/songs in GP? and are you using the GP Audio Streaming plugin? i also have forscore, but use OnSong since couple of my duo partners use onsong.

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This thread (going on at the same time) might be helpful (?)