With Microsoft switching to ARM for the latest Surface Pro, I’m absolutely certain the fact it has to emulate Windows means any program running on it–like Gig Performer or other DAWs–with have unacceptable levels of latency. Since I refuse to buy Apple products, I’m left with seeing about moving to Android. Is there any chance you’re developing an Android version of Gig Performer?
I wouldn’t make this assumption. ARM on Mac is generally faster than X86 even with emulation. Maybe the same would be true on Windows 11. Monitoring this thread as I’m interested also in what the future offers.
SteveC
But, correct me if I’m wrong, programs are already written for iOS anyway, as opposed to programs written for the Win32/64 where ARM is emulating the Windows OS environment. Since I refuse to use Apple, I’m left with continuing along with Windows or moving to Android. We already have a substantial inculcation of Samsung devices, so I at least want to investigate the potential for low-latency live midi performance. Ultimately, if I have to, I’ll just go back to hardware synth modules connected to my Keylab 88 Pro Mk II.
Huh? MS has native ARM builds of Windows, why would they have to emulate Windows? Are you talking about the ability to continue to run Intel programs in an ARM environment until ARM equivalents of such programs become available?
Well, Apple called this Rosetta 
Indeed - and Rosetta is incredibly efficient — when the first Apple Silicon machines showed up, people were able to run the Intel version of GP under Rosetta and it was totally usable.
But, as I’m finding out, those native ARM builds of Windows are still forced to emulate the Win32/64 environment for Windows programs. I watched a video of a guy pressure-testing virtual instruments on a Surface Pro X (which was the first ARM-based Surface Pro) and it didn’t handle it very well when you had multiple virtual instruments…latency was notable. Ultimately, I would LOVE to upgrade my Surface Pro 7 (i7) to the SP11 in order to run Gig Performer and other DAW software, but I’m not spending over $1000 on a device that will choke on it. If there’s an Android solution that’s viable, I’d rather go that route. I’m not doing Apple, period.
Is there reason why you do not use Apple?
I can’t stand them as a company and I hate their OS passionately.
Here’s an example of why I’m concerned: https://youtu.be/DihkTujuQzg?si=wNR6TUrko7gwFlT1
I like that OS as it is a Unix system and audio and midi is part of the OS.
Their OS is BSD Unix on top of the CMU Mach kernel. These are two of the most reliable and well respected platforms in the world. What don’t you like about them?
None of that matters to me. I hate using iOS. Every time I have to assist one of my friends–who are usually technically challenged–on how to do different things on their iPad or whatever, I’m reminded just how much I hate the operating system and Apple’s approach. I’m not shaming others for liking it. I’m simply stating where I’m at.
Look, I’m really not looking to get into an iOS vs Android vs Microsoft debate here. Everyone has their preferences. I like Gig Performer, and I was hoping that either 1) someone has actually run it or any other DAWs on a Surface Pro 11 satisfactorily or 2) knows of decent Android-based alternatives.
I think the real question here is—why a Surface Pro? There are plenty of other low profile/mini PC alternatives that aren’t ARM.
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I really like the form factor. I don’t always need the Type Cover, so the convertibility is fantastic. I love the design and the screens. I’ve had the SP3, SP5, SP6 (I still have it for set lists, music charts, remotely controlling our band’s digital mixer) and the SP7 (which I currently connect my Keylab 88 Pro MkII to for virtual instruments, playing live). The only reason I’m even looking to update is because the SP7 is starting to show it’s age, and eventually I expect the SSD to bite the dust because I DO run it pretty hard.
Why don’t you do it? MS make the Surface and the software (just like Apple), and the two go well together. Win 11 is a good system on a Surface. I recently upgraded from a SP 8 (i7/16 gig ram) to a SP 9 (i7/32 gig ram Gen 12 CPU) and I am very pleased with the way it runs GP under Win 11. I also installed a 2 TB ssd which I have partitioned into two with one partition just for storage and gigfiles. However, I did make sure that I bought an Intel powered machine after confirming on this forum that there wasn’t a GP build that would run under ARM. There are some good deals out there for Surface Pro 9, or you could hold off and in a years time, pick up a a business SP 10 (Intel of course) with either 32 or 64gig of ram. The SP 10 is over $5000 in NZ right now, and even if I wanted to splurge the $$$s, they are not available to me or the general public, as MS wants ordinary consumers to buy the ARM powered versions. I bought my SP 9 on Ebay from the UK, and I am delighted with it and how it runs GP.
You could also check out “Molten Music” as the guy there (Robin Molten (?) ) just loves Surface Pros and extensively tests each new model as they come out. His particularly focus is on how well they run music software. He recently did the Arm machine and its thumbs down for that one. His test on the SP 9 is thumbs up. Its worth a look.\
P.S - I’m like you in that I love the SP for its form factor and the other things you mention, I have had the 2, 3, 4, 6, 8, and now the 9. If you are upgrading, go for the 9 as it is a good deal faster. And 32 gig ram makes a big difference,
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True, unless there are native ARM builds of that programs (the same as with the Mac).
It’s actually Robin Molten that I watched to see what issues there might be. He didn’t have an SP11 yet, but he used the SPX for a reference (it was the first version that used ARM) and he made it quite clear he did NOT recommend trying to do any music production on the ARM-based units yet. Since the SP11 is ARM, he confirmed most of my fears. But, I can acknowledge he’s the only person I’ve seen talk about this. I’m looking for a second or third opinion from people who’ve tried to use the ARM-based Surface Pro as a virtual instrument host in live performance.
Why don’t you just stick with Intel machines? We might be pushed into ARM down the track, and the machines may be more suitable by then. In the meantime, MS are still producing business machines with Intel and up to 64 gig ram. I think in the US, they are available to the public, whereas I had to go to EBay living in New Zealand. But it was a new machine in a sealed box that I did get.
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