I have in my mind the perfect setup for my live gigs (hoping to start again soon…).
I recently switched to Mac and GigP, I need some hints to see if there is a good way to build my gig.
Requirements: midi keyboard controllers, audio board with a couple of stereo outputs.
Reason for that: I need a local monitor couple just close to me: on little stages guitar players use their amps and I never have a way to listen from PA in a good way.
Also with a guy on the mixer, during concert guitarist raise their volume and I am without my keyboard output monitoring. So a way to check volume on my monitor is mandatory.
Until now I used my NI Kontrol audio 6, driving a couple of little monitors from headphone output, a good way because there is separated potentiometer, so I have good control.
It s not perfect because this output is not balanced: with some lights on some stages, I got a lot of noise.
Best way should be a balanced output. A lot of audio boards have it, but very few with a separated potentiometer.
With two potentiometers I could play only on monitor while playing, leaving PA choices to mixer guy.
Another good way could be driving second output could with a MIDI CC driven on my controllers using GigP.
But I have some issues with GigP: this can be done easily on a rack view, but it implies making a control on every rack, I have a lot of them.
A good way seems to use two instances of GigP: one for my setlist racks, and one for general audio outputs and monitoring, but it adds some complexity I don’t like.
Is it true that a future version will have a “concert rack” common for full setlist? It would be my perfect thing…
Another option is to buy good audio board with double stereo output and software to drive it, new Audient id14 mkII or Evo8 seem to allow easy management of second output. This can be done in hardware or with some device software.
I am using in ear monitoring together with a RME UFX II.
The keyboard signal is sent stereo to the main mixer and all signals I need from the singer, bassist, guitarist etc I get back from them main mixer and goes into my RME.
So I have e Perfect mix.
The Bassdrum I get directly from a separate mic and the hihat and snare I get back from the main mixer.
This is perfect for me as I alway gets a perfect balance mix where I can clearly hear what I am playing and if it sits in the mix.
What sometimes is not so good:
I hear what others are playing ;-]
And I have the sample clicktrack in my mix as the drummer has.
Our FoH engineer uses the Behringer X32 and hands out personal mixers (P16) to the band members. You can choose exactly who you want to hear (or not!). Further, you can send MIDI messages into it to control it.
My rig consist of a Laptop running audio out to a skb rolling rack housing:
Scarlett 18i20 audio interface
QSC PLX 1802 power amp driving a couple Elite 10" wedges at my feet.
The signal coming out of the audio interface goes into two DI boxes in my rack. The balanced XLR lines go out FOH, while the “through signal” goes to my power amp for self monitoring my own sounds.
This allows me to monitor myself and turn my amp volume up and down, independent of what the FOH gets.
In-ears can also be run from the headphone outs on the audio interface. I can get a mix of the band from the monitor board (minus myself), into an input on my Scarlett (Just have to make sure that input signal ONLY goes to the headphone output and does not go to the outputs running to FOH!)
This way I control the volume of the band compared to my volume, in the audio interface mixer.
Have you considered a Radial Key Largo? Mine has been a constant in my setup since the day I bought it. They are not the cheapest option, but it’s a fantastic box and built like a tank. It’s perfect for running a laptop alongside hardware, plus it has the separate monitor output that I think you’re after.
You are right.
I turned to Mac some months ago, but I am still thinking in windows mode. I got news about KeyLargo and bad Windows performance.
On a Mac core audio should solve the matter
I’ve never run mine in a Windows setup. It has always worked brilliantly with my MacBook since the moment I plugged it in… so I can only base my opinion on that.
If you want to go full top spec there is also the Radial KL8 but thats probably too much overkill unless you are Rick Wakeman/Jordan Rudess!
The Key Largo does most of what that does, and it’s quite frankly an essential piece of gear for a live keyboard setup if you ask me.
Only issue I’ve come across is that after I got mine I thought i’d mount it on a pedalboard next to my Ventilator. Then I started getting into effects pedals for keyboards, and then that became an expensive habit!
Hi krucible, I am trying to do what I think you are doing. That is, have two separate signals from my kybd rig. One goes to FOH and the other to the onstage monitor mix. I don’t quite understand your setup though. You have two DI boxes so your sending a stereo pair from one DI to FOH and the other DI is used to send the signal to the onstage monitors? Right now my audio interface is a Steinberg UR22C which has only stereo outs (L+R). Do I need an audio interface with more physical outputs to achieve what your doing? Sorry, I’m not an experienced sound guy. I running a PC laptop to the Steinberg interface.
Thanks!
With your setup you may only need to add a small mixer. My rack actually has three DIs in it. I have two for my left and right outputs and one for a mono output in case the venue only runs mono or is lacking inputs (not something I run into these days). My Ashley line mixer has a mono output as well as stereo.
Each of the DIs have a 1/4" “through” output, so what ever signal comes from my audio interface (keys), goes out those, as well as the XLR jacks that go to the FOH.
Those “through” lines from the DIs go to my Ashley 1U rackmount mixer. I add the club’s monitor mix (without keys), to channels in the mixer. I can balance the signal from the club on the mixer channels, against my keyboard levels.
I then either run the line mixer output to a power amp to feed my personal wedges or monitor the audio from in-ears via the headphone jack of the mixer.
If you add a line mixer and mix your signals with the clubs monitor signal (without your keys) you should be able to get the same results. This is a halfway setup if your band does not have an in-ear rig to gig with.
I play in 5 bands and only one has the full in-ear system.
With my setup and the in-ear rig, I run audio to the house just the same (out the stereo left and right DIs). But I run the mono DI to our in-ear rig (it’s a mono in-ear system). I control my personal mix via a small tablet each of us use. It controls the aux mix each musician has for each channel in the in-ear rig.
Awesome…thanks for the detailed info! I think I could use a stereo DI also. Like the Radial ProD2 to send an XLR signal to FOH and the thru outputs back to my monitors/amp on stage. Do you ever run into venues that don’t want personal amps/wedges on stage. They want you to use the house’s monitor system only for stage sound? Thanks again, appreciate the info!
I had three whirlwind EDB1 di boxes in my rig a while ago. I replaced two of them with a Mackie MDB-2P Stereo Passive Direct Box. Kept the third whirlwind for the mono signal.
Have never run into a venue that wouldn’t want my own monitors on stage. In fact, venues that my bands without in-ears perform, regularly have a house wedge by me (for vocals and other instruments) as well as me having my own wedges. They are small “Elite” wedges that I’ve used for almost thirty years. They fit nicely under my rig.
Never had an issue from any venue.
This particular show I had two of my bands playing. One had the in-ears rig while the other did not. So I brought both ears and wedges to cover all bases.
