Bypass and Don't Bypass in Song Variations

[jeffn1]

That was very nice of you to do that. Thanks!

[schamass]

Always remember:
A variation of a rackspace only stores the values of the widgets that are used on this rackspace’s panel(s).
If there are no widgets, there will be nothing to store! Simple as that!

Whereas a rackspace itself does store the whole state of all the plugins it contains - even if there are no widgets used… so you could do what you tried with diffrent rackspaces (and no widgets), but life gets easier when you are going to use widgets.

[jeffn1]

In the past I always just created new rackspaces. To me the primary benefit of using variations in this way is you do not “waste” ram by duplicating rackspaces.

[dhj]

@jeffn1

you do not “waste” ram by duplicating rackspaces.

What else did you need your RAM for while you’re performing?

[jeffn1]

Hah, nothing, but I am always adding stuff (rackspaces and songs) and I’m starting close to 90% ram usage (at least on start up). I would like to keep running the “old” laptop, so I figured it is just more efficient not to unnecessarily use ram.

I would like to avoid predictive loading.

Do you think I am wrong?

Jeff

[Angel]

Instead of bypassing instrument plug-ins, I would recommend to use multiple MIDI in blocks, form the same controller, routed to the different instruments. Then you can use widgets to block note-on (!) mesages in the different MIDI-In blocks, thus switch plyaing this sound off and on. Then you can have different variations with different widget states giving different sounds.

You might check also this similar thread:

Switch Midi Channels via Variations & Patch Persist

My method for this without scriptlets or even without variations is: Let’s say you want to switch two sounds A and B within a song or rackspace, by pressing a button on your controller, or by variations, with holding notes while switching and avoiding hanging notes: Use two MIDI in ports, here called A and B, and route them to the sounds A and B, either by different MIDI output channels to one VST or different connections to two different VST. Don’t mind the number of MIDI in blocks, I have …

or a deluxe version by using scriptlets:

[Gig] Plugin Persist 2.0

This gig file contains the Plugin Persist 2.0 Scriptlet, the major overhaul of the Plugin Persist Scriptlet now with auto-sleep and fade out features. [Plugin-Persist-v2-by-David-san] Introduction: Many Gig Performer users build rackspaces in which they use button widgets to bypass/unbypass instrument plugins in the variations. As plugins themselves may not behave as you would expect when they are bypassed or unbypassed, this scriptlet adds more stability if a plugin is poorly implemented. N…

[jeffn1]

Yes, one benefit of using different rackspaces is patch persist. It is the way I am most comfortable doing things.

I was aware that a sciptlet was available to get the same effect if you use bypass. Up to now I have not used scriplets (or scripts(?)). But, maybe I should

I will have to consider what you are saying about different midi output channels. Right know that’s a bit ahead of where I am.

Jeff

[David-san]

@jeffn1

Up to now I have not used scriplets (or scripts(?)). But, maybe I should

At least you could. Scriptlets are nothing else then GP plugins built using GPScript. If you know what to do with a plugin you know what to do with a Scriptlet, no need to program anything simply use them.

[Angel]

@jeffn1

Yes, one benefit of using different rackspaces is patch persist.

With the methods I have described you can have patch persist of different sounds while switching them within one rackspace, just with variations.
Either without scriptlets, just by some widgets, or with scriptlets. It’s up to your preferences.

[jeffn1]

Thanks, Angel!

[thunderfingers]

I think of variations as duplicate rackspaces.

[Frank1119]

Variations only vary in the values of the widgets (and therefore the values of the assigned parameters). So the don’t take additional memory.

A duplicate rackspace, however, loads the same plugins as its original and takes the same amount of additional memory

[dhj]

@Frank1119

and takes the same amount of additional memory

No it doesn’t. The plugins are dynamically loaded and shared so code is reused. Only the data has to be addressed separately.

[jeffn1]

Okay, but in the case of sample-based instruments the bulk of the memory is due to that “data”. So, using variations and bypassing instruments would allow more efficient use of ram, it seems to me. [When I started I just always duplicated rackspaces. It was simple and intuitive. But, I am trying to be a bit more “ram aware” going forward.]

Of course, if I am missing something, I am always willing to learn.

[Frank1119]

@jeffn1

but in the case of sample-based instruments the bulk of the memory is due to tha

That’s what I was thinking

[dhj]

@jeffn1

but in the case of sample-based instruments the bulk of the memory is due to that “data

Sure — and that’s one of the reasons why, as much as possible, I prefer to avoid sample based plugins as much as possible for my core sounds (acoustic pianos, electric pianos, organs, synths, etc)

Physical modelling all the way down

[amosdef]

@dhj

Physical modelling all the way down

I couldn’t agree with this more. It’s been a huge part of my strategy to be able to have rackspaces for each song without the worry of whether the sample memory was being managed efficiently. When I do use sample based VSTs, I try to get the ones that use the smallest amount of memory to do the job

[jeffn1]

Yes, I definitely do see the logic in that.

Maybe it works for some instruments (synths, organs, electric piano, probably acoustic piano), but not others. I just got a great blues harmonica, fiddle, banjo, not sure about bass.

So, maybe you want to be aware of 1. Physical Modeling options, 2. Lower ram sample libraries, 3.Ram conscious use of variations 4. Lowering ram cache settings and Kontakt ram purging, etc. Also, newer computers (including laptops) have more ram capability (up to 128 GB).

Jeff

[pianopaul]

@jeffn1

not sure about bass.

Try Modo Bass from IK Multimedia

[amosdef]

Modo Bass is amazing. I don’t have a use for it live (yet) but it’s so fun to play and sounds amazing