88-key controller: NI, Arturia, or ...?

Not yet.
I prepared a long setlist for my cover band, 60 songs.
With some racks I was able to make a full list rendering with many sounds.
Perfect for rehearsal we started recently.
If we will have a gig in June, I will need to prepare a more detailed setup with two midi controllers.
But up to now I never needed to start studying scripts

Ok, then GP seems to meet your needs :wink:

Oh yes!
100% until now.
With version 4 I can implement an independent output for monitoring, with volume driven by a potentiometer of my controller.
Something I had in mind since years.
I can buy any audio board with 4 outputs.
GigP will allow something that hardware until today cannot fulfill

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Thanks for the info and the pix. My Sweetwater rep recommends the NI (of course if Iā€™m cynical I could say that could be because it has the highest markup for them), but I did wonder about being tied into the Komplete software. So are you saying that you really donā€™t use Gig Performer, just Komplete Kontrol? I really like what I can do with GP as far as splitting my keyboard from all my different sound sources - my live situation calls for a lot of keyboard splits.

No, itā€™s exactly the other way around: I donā€™t use Komplete Kontrol, because iā€™ll have the keyboard being switched to MIDI-mode to work properly in Gig Performer (which is what i want).

The Komplete software provides two things:

  • a plugin (VST) which lets you easily browse through all the sounds that are somehow ā€œcompatibleā€ with the Komplete environment (it does not only find and display NI plugins!).
  • a kind of driver software that runs in the background and takes care of the keyboards configuration settings, updates, etc.

The keyboards also have diffrent use modes:

  • ā€œPlugin modeā€ - this is what makes use of the colored displays and all the ā€œeasy accessā€ buttons to browse through the plugins, but this is not what you can use in Gig Performer (though it can be cool for crawling through your libraries without GP) - this mode needs a running instance of Komplete Kontrol (as standalone or VST)
  • ā€œMIDI modeā€ - this is the mode you want to use for Gig Performer! This mode lets you configure all the knobs and buttons to your personal needsā€¦ but this mode doesnā€™t make use of the colorful displays (see my pics above).

So, as soon as you load Komplete, no matter if you use the standalone software or the VST, the keyboard switches automatically to ā€œPlugin modeā€! Thatā€™s why i donā€™t use the Komplete Kontrol VST in GP.

After all, one is kind of forced to install the Komplete software because there is not so much you can do with the keyboard if you donā€™t (no user config is loaded), but you donā€™t have to use the plugin (just use the NI plugins separately) and of course you can use the keyboard with Gig Performer as you want to (splits and all this)ā€¦

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Huge thanks for explaining this in detail, this is what I wasnā€™t clear about with the NI controller and software.

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What is his recommendations regarding a plugin host software? Just to see if you can really trust him. :wink: (tell him you want to own the stageā€¦ :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:)

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He wasnā€™t familiar with GP even though Sweetwater lists it ā€¦ he admitted he didnā€™t know a lot about live performance with MIDI controller and software, so he was honest about that. That seems quite common, most people seem to be using VSTs in recording situations - so Iā€™m glad to have this forum as a great resource and thanks for your help! :slightly_smiling_face:

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I really liked the idea of those big displays on the NI controllers, along with the endless knobs, the buttons, etc.

Then I discovered what you wrote - none of that works unless you run through the Komplete Kontrol software. I then looked elsewhere, since I wanted wanted displays I could actually use the way I wanted to use the and integrate them into GP.

Native Instruments does say they work with developers on integration into DAWs and for VSTs, but beyond that I couldnā€™t find much information other than creating NKS files for different VSTs so they can show up in the Komplete Kontrol library.

Iā€™ve seen a little of the Ableton integration on YouTube videos, but not enough to give me a feel for how it really works. I went so far as to track down the Ableton python scripts that control its interactions with the Komplete S Mk2 line, but didnā€™t see much going on with the displays other than showing tracks, VU meters, and moving around them.

I moved past the Arturia line because the display is just a small text display. I wanted something where I could see and update in real time what parameters are assigned to which knob or button.

I ended up with a Novation SL MKIII, which for my purposes has the most useful and usable displays, but it doesnā€™t come in an 88 key version, or piano action keys.

Stepping way back to the original question - 88 key weighted controller for use with GP - I settled on having a good feeling master keyboard (still using my ancient Roland A90), and using something else for knobs, buttons, etc. The hardest part of that for me is having an accessible and stable place to put the control surface.

If I were going to replace my master keyboard today Iā€™d find somewhere to play with a Studiologic SL88 Grand. Iā€™d use that just for the keys, and it has a surface plates you can attach to it to hold a laptop, tablet, or a control surface (like an Icon Platform M+).

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Hi ncarson8,

last year i was in a similar situation like you: new to GP and the world of MIDI controllers and VSTs. Main selection criteria for the controller was a good (piano) keybed and 88 keys and some controls for the the VSTs and the possibility to have different layers. Weight was not very important as it will only be used at home.

After some research and testing i finally bought a Studiologic SL88 Grand together with a SL Mixface and SL computer plate (not cheap but a good bundle price for ex demo).

I had a real piano many many years ago and iā€™m still a absolut beginner. So my experience is limited, but i think the SL 88 keybed is great and feels like a real piano. It is of cause limited if you play a organ or synth VST3. But with the adjustments to the velocity its ok and usable. You can adjust the 4 available layers to the different instruments and define velocity or aftertouch. The SL Mixface supports also 4 different layers (eg instruments).

After one year iā€™m still very happy with the SL88. Nevertheless i had also some lessons learnt:

  • the 3 XY sticks are not really useful ā€¦ i would prefer pitch and mod wheels
  • i thought i need aftertouch ā€¦ but so far iā€™m used it rarely
  • SL88 has a nice display and a selection wheel in the middle - but i donā€™t need it
  • the 4 layers are not needed as you can do the layers also with gig performer. The SL88 may provide a bit more options to tweak the layers, but i have not done a detailed comparison.

What I also learnt is that a 2nd keyboard with a Organ or Synth keybed (with mod and pitch wheel) may be useful and a good supplement. The SL88 has no controls and you can place the 2nd keyboard on top of the SL88. The display and selection wheel is not needed (you can cover it with the 2nd keyboard) and the Mixface can be place anywhere.

Would i buy it again ā€¦ yes due to the keybed.

Do i see a good alternative: maybe the Korg D1. It has no aftertouch no XY sticks and all the controls are on the left side ā€¦ more and better space for a 2nd keyboard. The keybed should also be good, but it has less options for pedals.

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I forgot that there might one other candidate for the job:

Technically it should have more features then anyone would needā€¦ but i canā€™t really say anything about the quality or the usability of this monster.

I am on the side of @charly and @vindes with their statements.
If i had to go for an 88key controller, i might also tend to the Studiologic keyboards, since the seem to have really nice keybeds, but i canā€™t get along with their tiny joysticks (they suck!).
So, if you donā€™t need a real pitchbend and mod-wheel, this could be a good choice.
Get an additional controller board with knobs, buttons and faders which can be placed on top of the Sudiologic and youā€™d be good to go!
You could use something like the Icon Platform M+ or the much cheaper and smaller Behringer X-Touch mini, but maybe there are yet some other devices availableā€¦

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Iā€™m using the SL88 but I hate those joysticks

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the only good use i found sofar: i used one XY stick to control the leslie speed (left - right) and the leslie brake (top - down)

Wowā€¦ i really appreciate all the research you put into this topic.
But it actually seems that NI is not open to share their knowledge or to develop for smaller companies that are not Steinberg or similar.
It is a real pity when you have two big color displays right in front of your nose which could easily show videos or animations, and all you can get are two monochromatic lines of text. meh.
Somewhere in the net i found a little utility someone wrote with which you could switch off the keybed illumination (which canā€™t be disabled by default), but that was all i could find for 3rd party programming.

I like to use a short aftertouch-press to switch between leslie speeds, works great with GP-script!

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clever and smart !! good idea :+1:

Thanks everyone, so much great info. The Studiologic SL88 with Mixface looks very interesting and Iā€™m hearing all good things ā€¦ Grand is too heavy for gigging though (for me, at least), so maybe the Studio.

try both - the Grand and the Studio. I didnā€™t like the studio keybed and the decision for the grand was an easy one as i only use it at home.

One of the best things about my Keylab88 is indeed all the ā€˜knobs and slidersā€™. Donā€™t forgetā€¦ there are two banks of them! This allows for a lot of flexibility. In this example, Iā€™m using Bank A to manage playback of my stem-based backing tracks. Bank B is assigned to live B3. The Fatar keybed is a dream but make sure you get some ā€˜hands-onā€™ before you commit to anything.

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The Studiologic SL 88 Studio and the Arturia Keylab88 both use the same Fatar TP/100LR keybeds. Studiologic is a brand thatā€™s made by Fatar

The Keylab 88 also has that same nice flat area above the keys to the right where you can sit another controller, and the same kind of flat shelf add on as the Studiologic for putting a laptop or control surface on. Also has a similar clamp on music stand, which you could obviously put a tablet on and use that for touch control using OSC. Or a modestly sized touch screen monitor.

Thereā€™s enough similarity between the Keylab 88 and Studiologic 88 + Mixface that Iā€™d be surprised if there wasnā€™t some idea sharing in the development.

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